"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have"
Thomas Jefferson

Saturday, August 8, 2009

Much To Do...

The liberal media elite, including the august NY Times is writing the GOP's obituary up north regardless of the facts.

Yes, Darrel Aubertine has won elections that have secured his incumbency, primarily by parochial interest over Patty Ritchie in a district specifically drawn for him and then by using class warfare over Barclay, but by only a couple of thousand votes in each case - hardly a mandate! 

Yet, he was their best choice and more importantly the only choice for Congress, a fact that is reinforced by their inability to field a second string. Now, by all indications, the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee will sit out the race.

Meantime, they keep trying to tag Dede as a RINO, even though she could be a poster child for the smaller government, less taxes and spending, more freedom set. People disagree with her views on abortion and gay marriage, OK, that's a subject for rational debate.

We're all making way too much of this "abandoning our roots" thing relative to Dede. On nearly every count, she's as rock-rib conservative as they come; spending, guns, military. But on two hot-button issues, she is divergent in what conservatives believe and the national media spins this as a moment of soul-searching for the GOP, hardly.

If you were in the room in Gouverneur the dichotomy of the Republican party was evident; there were those who played up to the conservative wing and those who explained their diverse beliefs. But the Republican party is not a lot different than their counterparts in the Democratic party who have difficulty dealing with party in fighting, State Senate as an example, and the more conservative wing of blue dogs.

Can you really challenge Dede on her other credentials? She's an accomplished local leader, a woman, she stands up and runs with the big boys in Albany and she could be a strong advocate for the North Country way of life.

Also, what's this about Democrat-leaning? It ignores the fact that Democrats can't even find a candidate with a shot against a "liberal" Republican other than Darrel, what evidence is there that the Republican party is dying up North, aside from the hype created by operatives?


hermit thrush said...

i don't think the times' article goes nearly so far as to "write the gop's obituary up north" -- i would think a seasoned poltico like you would have a thicker skin, piv!

i think it's more that republicans have had a monopoly on political power in the north country since, well, about forever, but there have been some serious challenges to that lately -- not just aubertine, but obama did carry the 23rd, and also look at gillibrand's and murphy's success in the neighboring 20th. and the article is really about how the gop is dealing with these new challenges, viewed in this case through the lens of dede's candidacy.

while i disagree with your overall take on the article, you're absolutely correct about some of your more particular complaints. like this sentence which you singled out:

But in a district that voted for Mr. Obama and has been leaning Democratic, Ms. Scozzafava could find her party affiliation a hindrance, regardless of her social leanings.

yup, i think that's bs too. it's true that the 23rd has been moving in a more democratic direction of late, but i sure think it's still a lean-republican district. and while i'm too lazy to look for numbers to back this up, i think dede's party affiliation will be a huge asset. maybe i'm wrong, but i think the gop has a pretty sizable registration advantage in the 23rd. i think a lot of those republican voters have been alienated by the severe conservative turn the national party has been taking, but they'd welcome the chance to vote for someone they see as more moderate.

Earthbob said...

What about the Unaffiliated Voters?

Typically they are referred to as independents, as if they voted in monolithic way.

They do break down into different spectrum of issues, but not like the Republican factions.

Dede has an advantage if she can get either volunteer or professional canvassers to the Unaffiliated Voters' doors.

The 23rd is vast and she has the time.

Requires more doers than planners...

Anonymous said...

Here we go again, mr thrush. How does one react to the "Republicans monopoly on power since, well, forever" bs. Donkeys hold almost all the offices in the region now, Klerm. Repeatly describing a situation that changed over a decade ago seems a little stupid.

As far as the times is concerned, most of us see it for what it is. They have moved so far to the left they, like you, are predictable on every issue. While you keep your nose at its usual angle, the times does the same. They love all programs, all government, and maintain such a close relationship with special interests that they'd be well advised to use condoms in their daily work related activities. In other words, my friend, they're on your side. I'm not surprised to see you defending them. You should. But be sure to wear protection.

woodchucksage said...

"But the Republican party is not a lot different than their counterparts in the Democratic party..."

That's the freakin' problem, Ivy!!! Some of us want to be different, that's why there are two DIFFERENT parties!!!

Dede wants to keep the lines fuzzy - suck up to labor leaders and other special interests who traditionally HATE Republicans. While local labor flunkies like her husband have supported her Assembly campaigns (primarily because she was a sure winner and no reasonable alternative was available - for an example of this mentality ask former Asseblywoman Chloe Ann O'Neil about her race against 22-year=old Jason Clark), Washington labor bosses will never allow support for a Republican if there is a viable Dem in the race.


Dede has always tried to have it both ways and she may get away with it again, unless Mike Long and the other idiot Conservatives are succesful with their very, very long shot, unknown candidate.

The comments are interesting. One point that is missing is that while the 23rd is still heavily GOP, the largest employers continue to be public schools, prisons and the state government. These people and their unions love BIG government and the spending that comes with it, so they vote for Liberals and Socialists like Schumer, Clinton, Obama because they want to protect their meal tickets.

Anonymous said...

iv, you conveniently didn't mention darrel's 2:1 win over scott gray in a republican year. also what about ajr's decisive win? The democrats now have a commanding majority on the st. lawrence and franklin county legislatures. I am surprised, though, that no elected officials are pursuing the democrat nomination. And given obama's declining approval ratings i think this is dede's to lose, though she could very well lose.

As far as dede being rino, yes she did vote against this year's state budget, gun control legislation and the farm labor bill. She has, however, consistantly rubber stamped expensive pension benefits for public employees (which raise local property taxes). Also, she voted for last year's budget which raised cigarette taxes. And then there is her support for medical marijuana.

hermit thrush said...

... and it's another hateful, vile screed from the raging conservative base. i'm sure that will win lots of readers to the conservative point of view.

getting back to the post itself, though, let's look again at this:

On nearly every count, she's as rock-rib conservative as they come....

is that really right? sure, dede's stances on abortion and same sex marriage get all the press. but according to the article, she only gets a rating of 15 out of 100 from the nys conservative party.

what's the deal? is piv ignoring a bunch of other issues besides abortion and ssm? are the conservative party's ratings out of line? is there something misleading about the article?

i'm inclined to like dede, which leads me to suspect she's no rock-ribbed conservative. but at any rate, something's gotta give.

Anonymous said...

"Is Paris burning as I ordered." Adolf Hitler asked his Chief of Staff, Alfred Jodl. "Yes, my Fuhrer, yes of course."
Almost exactly 65 years later in America.
"what evidence is there that the Republican party is dying up North, aside from the hype created by operatives?"PIV asked on his blog to his devoted ditto heads."They (people you have a different opinion) love all programs, all government, and maintain such a close relationship with special interests that they'd be well advised to use condoms in their daily work related activities. In other words, my friend, they're on your side. I'm not surprised to see you defending them. You should. But be sure to wear protection."said 'The Anonymous Wingnut'.
When is a 'cause' lost anyway?

DownStateOperative said...

Bruno? Are you ever able to discuss an issue without trying to personally insult the person you are conversing with?

Anonymous said...

And ow for the real "stuff", her position with her brothers Co., And the amount of money funneled into it by the IDA's.

hermit thrush said...

per dso's question (with props to atrios):

no. this has been another edition of simple answers to simple questions.

Anonymous said...

Kerm and Downstate, get a room.
Nothing vile about it, Frog. You just say stupid things and expect no one to call it what it is. Sorry.

It really doesn't matter what the results are of this election. Dede will vote to support anything a Dem will support, and on issues she differs it won't make a difference anyway. That, along with it being a temporary position, means you followers are arguing about a decision (by voters) that really doesn't exist.

Anonymous said...

Hey anon sice the election what has AJR done??????? And hiring Ted Ford, and getting Uncle Al on the county board don't count.

FlatsFarmer said...

I am not sure you even read the article, PIV. For you to compare it to or call it an obituary in any sense was another example of your ever increasing paranoia.

Soon you will be needing a tinfoil hat.

You dismissed what was an excellent report about changing politics and people in the North by calling the Times "liberal media elite". That was my first clue that your probably did not even read it. Or, if you did, you certainly did not understand it.

HT is 100% correct on this one.

hermit thrush said...

sorry to keep piling on our hapless anon, but i guess i lack the willpower to resist right now. consider this little claim from his spittle-flecked missive above:

Donkeys hold almost all the offices in the region now

in lewis county, where i grew up, the county legislature is 9-1 republican-democrat.

in jefferson county, the county legislature is 13-2 republican-democrat.

as piv recently pointed out (all too typically, without giving attribution to his/her source), jefferson county last elected a democrat to the u.s. house of representatives in 1850; st. lawrence county, in 1854; franklin county, in 1850; clinton county, in 1870; lewis county, in 1890; and essex county, in 1870. (incredibly, some of those dates are before the republican party even existed!)

so look, anon, i think you should make it a personal policy to never ever ever go calling anything anyone else says "stupid." that sort of thing has a tendency to come back and bite you.

Anonymous said...

Frog, I never knew how little old me, who supposedly has nothing of substance to say, always seems to warrant a knee jerk reaction and defense from you. Why, if I'm losing it, do you feel the need to respond to me as you do? Keep your spirits up, Frog. And don't worry so much about what I say.

If you think Dede is good stuff, then go with it, Frogger. It's fine with me. The fact that someone like you supports her shows how weak a candidate she is. But it's just a temp position anyway. Get over it.

As far as "most office holders being Donkeys". My dear slither skin, I stand by that. You got Sen A, AJR, County Clerk, County Judge, Sheriff, and now most of your state appointed folks. This is a donkey state, Klemit, and we're headed toward the same political makeup as Brooklyn. I don't really care, as I'm about to retire and it likely is better for me that we keep spending as much as possible. But to deny we're going Donkey too is a little dumb, and stupid, even on your standards, Kernit.

LiberalLaugh said...

"I don't really care, as I'm about to retire."

Oh no, Anon. is going to turn into a retired socialist and collect pension and social security and medical benefits........ unless, of course, he remains a true patriotic republican conservative and refuses all social programs.


DownStateOperative said...

Hey Bruno! When you retire and start sucking from the public trough are you going to join those old fart tea baggers and shout down anyone who advocates people getting benefits from the government?

GOP Darrel Supporter said...

I don't think this is an obit, but I agree with part of your premise IV. My fellow Republicans dislike Darrel because they think he's paving the way for liberal Democrats to have control of the area.

Not so, even if the ultra liberal Russell got elected. She didn't have a chance in the Congress race against Doheny, DeDe or this Conservative Party guy. None of these democrats do unless they show they're like Darrel. Which at first blush, I'd say they're not.

The truth is that Darrel is electable because he is Darrel. He would have won for Congress. He's an intelligent, down home farmer and conservative Democrat. He's proof off our ideals up here. Hard work, family and faith get the job done. He'll get my vote every time because I've known him a long time and I know he works hard.

Anonymous said...

No Downstate, I'm gonna be cruising. I'll be sure to tell you where to mail the check. Might even take up skateboarding.

As far as screwing my fellow man with increased govment benefits, I don't have to do that. I have people like you doing that for me. I mostly fish. Keep up the good work.

DownStateOperative said...

"I mostly fish"

BRUNO! You naughty, naughty socialist.

You fish? You take advantage of the public programs that ensure protection of a sport you enjoy? The stocking. The protection. The facilities. Did you know that the bouys and markers that protect and guide you come from a social program. Do you do GPS? Charts. More social benefits. Parks, lake, streams all provided for and cared for with public funds. What about national parks? You can get one of those free senior passes you know, you little socialistic bugger, you.

LittleWillyBarcleee said...


Stay off my river!!

Anonymous said...

But on a brighter note Renzi Bros. has been paid.

Anonymous said...

Come to Clayton if you like fishing and boating. We have two fine docks with very good restrooms. Free! Free! Free! Even to the man who hates social programs. Parking will cost ya, tho.

Anonymous said...

I don't own the river. You have me confused with that lawyer, some guy named French. The elitist who was going to be our Sen, but declined. He owns the river.

And no Downstate, I don't much need charts anymore. Too old. If I don't hear any clunks, I figure I didn't hit anything.

Thanks for all the recent attention.

Anonymous said...

A few years the French guy was the lawyer who represented the EJ Noble hospital, he also had a vendetta against the Cigar boats, funy thing the boats had a "benefit" for the hospital.

Anonymous said...

Bruno? Do you drink?

Anonymous said...

About a 12 pack, a year.

Anonymous said...

On the "brighter" side there's a mystery invester "paying" off some of Tom's debt. Wonder if it's Jim W.

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